Using the electric efficiently

[Jim Mac]

Hi All, I have some questions regarding usage of energy produced..

I have my 1kw windmill and 4x120watt solar panels going to my 24V battery bank.. Then I have a 3.5 kw outback inverter / charger...

I went ahead and purchased a smaller 6 breaker electric panel and wired the outback inverter to it. So now I have the original on-grid panel and my off-grid panel.. So I started pulling out circuits from my on-grid panel and moving them to the off-grid panel..

My question is, is this the best way to do it? Should I have 2 panels like this? Or is there an easier way to use the electricity I am producing?

I keep moving circuits over to the off-grid panel but when the sun's out or the winds blowing, I am still dumping 1/2 the day... I could be powering much more than I currently am..

Without backfeeding, is there a better way?

[Ralph Day]

Sure, just put all your circuits on the inverter supported panel. Have a circuit on the utility panel dedicated to the inverter as a charging source. When your renewables are not sufficient to keep the State of Charge up, you use the utility power to charge your batteries. It's like living off grid but your generator is the multi-billion dollar utility instead of a little noisy contractor generator.

Ralph

[Ric Murphy]

Jim,
I have virtually the identical system to yours. Only difference is I have 300w more solar. What I did was select enough circuits to move to my sub panel that would slightly exceed what the system is capable of supporting (on average). In my Outback inverter I use the HBX mode. The inverter will power the loads whenever there is enough sun/wind to keep the battery above the "use grid" voltage setting. When the battery drops below that point then it switches to the grid. When the sun/wind have recharged the battery sufficiently then the inverter switches back to the battery. I have my charger turned off in the inverter so it does not use the grid to recharge the battery. Is this how you are using your system? You may be able to use the auxilary in the inverter to trigger additional loads at times when you have surplus energy available.
Ric

[Jim Mac]

Ric,

I been digesting the manuals but never made it to the HBX mode settings.. I was wondering why my electric bill did nothing but go up.. Turns out I was pulling 100% off the grid and not even using my renewable energy!!

I just went through and changed it ti HBX mode with the factory 24/26v settings as you described.. And finally I can confirm I'm using my energy! Very excited...

I'm sure I have way more on my sub-panel than I am producing so I will need to buy more panels very shortly.. Good thing Obama extended the renewable energy tax credit:)

Anyways, I have one more question to throw out there.. I have no way of knowing how many watts I am producing with my solar.. My windmill charge controller has a crappy logger so I have a general idea.. On a windy night, I can produce 2 kilowatt hours.. But I have no idea how much my solar is producing.. Can you recommend a device that I can get that logs my solar production??

Thanks again for the wonderful info!

[Ric Murphy]

Jim,
Glad I can help someone out every once in awhile!!! When you're new to this stuff it can be very confusing. It will take you awhile to tweek a number of settings in order to maximize your systems efficiency. But you have to accept that you will never be able to use 100% of what you produce. You will always have some "spillage" but thats not necessarily a bad thing. I may be able to help some more but need to know what other equipment you have. I assume you have a Mate to program your inverter. What are you using for a solar charge controller? Unfortuantely it costs money just to find out what you're producing and using. I use the Outback FlexnetDC with 3 shunts to get the info I want. One shunt between the inverter and battery, one between the turbine controller and battery and the 3rd between the solar charge controller and battery. This allows me to see what the wind and solar are putting into the battery and what the inverter is taking out of the battery. There are a number of computer programs available that are compatable with the Outback gear (I use Wattplot). Unfortunately they all require a computer running 24/7 to collect the data which consumes some of the energy you're producing (unless you're already running a computer 24/7 for some other reason)
Ric

[Jim Mac]

Thanks Ric,

I have a Whisper 200 charge controller with the digital display for the windmill.. http://www.affordable-solar.com/adjustable-multi-voltage-controller-for-whipser-wind-generators.htm The display has a setting that logs power produced. The controller has a built in heater / dumpload.

The solar goes into my coleman air https://www.colemanair.us/vp_asp/scripts/shopexd.asp?bc=no&ccode=C160 charge controller then to the same battery bank as the windmill. The coleman air controller does not have any readouts.. I have the dump settings on the coleman air set to 2 volts higher than my whisper controller so it never dumps unless the whisper controller fails..

I want to remove my coleman air controller and use on on my homemade panels to power shed lighting. But I haven't done that yet..

Charge controller goes to my 8 golf cart battery bank (around 200 amp hours) then to a 100 amp breaker , from there to the outback. All battery DC lines are 1 gauge 100 amp wire.

I'm good with computers and have mine on 24/7 so any info about that is also good:)

Your help is appreciated!

[Ric Murphy]

Hi Jim,
If you move your current solar charge controller to another application what are you planning to use for your existing 4-120w panels? Buy another? If so then maybe you could get one with data logging capability. The old Outback MX60'a logged 64 days worth of data. I assume the new FM60 & 80's will also.

You'll want experiment with the HBX voltage/time settings. On my system I consider 24v as 50% discharged. If I use 24v as my grid use set point then as soon as the system drops the battery and connects to the grid, the battery voltage instantly rises .2-.4 volts or more. I usually lower this setting by that amount except in winter since my batteries are in an unheated shed. Same holds true for your upper limit. As soon as the loads get switched to the battery the voltage drops. Your time setting on each of these will also have an impact.
Hope this helps
Ric
P.S I made an error in my earlier post. I actually have 2-1/2 times as much solar as you do (1200w)

[Jim Mac]

I like your first suggestion Ric, so I ordered

1. Flexnet DC
2. 3 shunts 500
3. Flex B Bus
4. 4 port hub

And after tax season I plan to snatch up 8 more panels for my solar grid..

Just for clarification, I know my system will not respond exactly like yours, but you have your outback set to: 23.4 / 26.6 ?

A few days ago after we chatted, I adjusted mine to 23/25 to start.. I am under the impression I will be able to see more battery-state info once I get the flexnet DC..

Thank you for all your help, and I'm sure I will be asking more once the new goodies comes in:unsure: